An Open Letter To Yelp Reviewers of Vietnamese Restaurants

• Dave, I think you are being a bit obtuse but I agree to disagree. Have a good one. 

• Yes, exactly. You found my article through whatever means—presumably the Internet—and set out to correct it. Tomorrow you'll probably find someone else you don't agree with and go out to correct it. If just one person stops and considers this before dashing off a review, especially a negative one, based on one visit, it'll be worth all the corrections from random strangers trying to validate their contributions to a site that's notorious for taking all the content people will feed it and giving next to nothing in return. I don't concern myself with the weed dispensary ads; that's why there's literally a wall between the editorial and sales departments. Have fun! <I>Joyeux Noël!</I>

• Yeah, you don't actually get informed opinions. Ever read the reviews for Red Medicine? Three quarters of the people never visited there, thanks to their antics with S. Irene Virbila (that's the restaurant critic for the <I>Los Angeles Times</I>, by the way). Did you read the reviews for Momofuku after David Chang's little rant? Full of "informed reviews" about what a douchenozzle people thought he was. Anyone who thinks Yelp is objective or informed either only reads a carefully curated friendslist or is delusional. You're welcome to your delusions, even here in real life where the sky is blue and Vietnamese restaurants have their own service standards that everyone except whiny Yelpers seems to know about. Feel free, though, to keep on correcting me, if you think you need practice.

• On second thought, I digress. I appreciate your opinion on how others should Yelp, I just feel differently and didn't think you understood how most Yelpers use the site. I wasn't going for a personal attack and picking a fight with you and the "Ask a Mexican" guy. 

• Superior? Wait a minute, did I post the write up about how others should write Yelp reviews based on my perception of what "real Vietnamese" is and should be? You are divorced from reality if you honestly believe that, you have it backwards.  Yelp is an open forum, "Real people, real reviews" is the tagline. You have every right to your opinion of what the "Vietnamese experience" is, but don't bag on Yelp at large for not agreeing with you.I often disagree with other Yelpers, but I would never tell them how they should write their reviews. The beauty of Yelp is that I get informed opinions from people that actually went to restaurant and shared their experience, regardless of their previous knowledge with the cuisine. They are not professional critics, we all get that. 

• And keep wasting your time for the Yelp machine, chula!

• The internet? I am correcting your cheesy article.. Fair enough it is your forum, carry on telling people how to Yelp and sell weed dispensary ads with your hard hitting blog, son!  Cry harder...

• Ohhh....Gee, it's myyyyyy fault the food sucked because I ordered the wrong thing.  My bad.  Silly me for thinking that if a place is putting something on the menu and charging you for it, it should be good and not have to be their specialty.  As if they should be held accountable for serving up crap, just because their chef only knows how to make one thing.  This author is an absolute dope.

• Aren't you done correcting the Internet yet?

• BURN...

• There are precious, precious few upscale Vietnamese restaurants worth the money. They exist, but they are few and far between. Usually when I ask Vietnamese people—especially older ones—about upscale Vietnamese restaurants, they snort and say, "It doesn't even smell like fish sauce!"

• I know Vietnamese food. I eat Vietnamese food every week, despite not being Vietnamese. If I had to move away from Orange County, I'd bemoan the fact that Little Saigon isn't directly down the street and the lack of fill-in-your-Viet-food-of-choice here. So when I read reviews from people who obviously don't have the least clue how Vietnamese food is supposed to be, no, it isn't relevant. Reading that they're all miffed that waiters didn't fawn on their table and refill their water for them tells me that they don't know how a Vietnamese restaurant works, and I skip their review. I agree that I can usually gauge the worth of a restaurant by its aggregate rating—for example, the 1 1/2 star rating for Captain Kidd's in Anaheim was enough to tell me what it's probably like. If the reviews aren't worth it, though, and the only point of Yelp is as an aggregate rating tool, why on earth bother to put the reviews up in the first place? Feel free, however, to feel superior to me. I won't mind a bit, because I won't be thinking about it in about thirty seconds.

• You probably only understand the Americans, but people are bitching in all those languages that you don't understand.  That is all.  People are people.

• Yawn... Next troll...

• someone's a defensive yelper.

• you're confusing Vietnam with Southern California. Yes, dog meat is served in Vietnam. No, dog meat is not served in Vietnamese restaurants in Southern California. 

• Well said. I am not Vietnamese but I have enjoyed many a good meal at the area restaurants, and experienced some that were less than memorable. It's the same with any restaurant, some are great and some aren't. Anyone who doesn't like what they got, stop eating it, but don't be a whiner about it. Instead just find somewhere else to dine. For the record though, anyone who hasn't explored Vietnamese food is missing out big time, that cuisine is in a league of its own, far from other asian countries.

• OC Weekly, Cry harder. Jeena from Yelp.

• Great post! Wish everyone would read this before stepping into a Vietnamese restaurant!

• Boring comment!

• Kind of a boring article on a tired subject. If you don't like Yelp reviews, stop reading them. I am a prolific Yelper and I didn't tell you how to write this article, please do not tell me how to write my reviews. If the service sucks, I want to know, If the food is not up to snuff, I want to know. Asian establishments fail to understand the service aspect of American dining and they suffer because of it, whether or not they care is another matter altogether. The whole point of the reviews are to know what you are getting into in the first place and what you are calling "annoying reviews" I call "relevant information".   Even the "dog" part... I am Korean and get that all of the time. Stop reading and move on. You are not using Yelp correctly as a reference tool and just devoted a column to that fact.  I can scan over 100 reviews in less than a minute to figure out who is credible and knows what they are talking about and if there are over 200 reviews and the place averages 2 and a half stars, I think the public has spoken. Sorry, but you are part of the problem. 

• I agree with your above arguments from 1-5 but the 6th one I cannot let go. I always get rude service. They always act like it's my fault when they get my order wrong when I point at a menu and furthermore they cuss in Vietnamese like I don't understand what's going on. I've worked at an upper middle class Vietnamese restaurant and the owners treat me like crap and they don't even pay me right. They take hours off my paycheck and pay me less than 30% of my actual tips and they act like they're doing me a favor. I've heard it's generally the same at most other Vietnamese restaurants. Food isn't that much better, sometimes they serve rotten or food they spilled on the floor or even food customers have already eaten. It's disgusting and there is no class in that. I'm glad I've gotten out of that job and I know that many people know this to be true. 

• ... which is missing the point entirely, as I certainly wasn't suggesting Khoisan waiters are more likely to spit in your food.

• Doesn't matter if it's the norm, it still isn't good service! A rose by any other name...

• Brilliant...Thank you!

• Do you know what "intimate" means when used as a verb?  It means "to communicate indirectly."  So the author was saying "Just because you didn't like the meat doesn't mean you should imply that it was actually dog."  How is that a racist joke?  The author was criticizing the people who make racist jokes.  You just didn't understand what he meant.

• The article should have linked to examples of these bad reviews.

• ha ha ha, mike smith is just mad because he's a virgin.

• You should look at our archives: http://blogs.ocweekly.com/stickaforkinit/viet_vittles Lee's is the McDonald's of bánh mì. Cho Cu, Che Cali, Mr. Baguette, Gala Bakery, Tip Top Sandwiches, Lynda Sandwiches, Nhu Lan Bakery, all better than Lee's for sandwiches. We did a whole series this March called Final Pho: http://blogs.ocweekly.com/stickaforkinit/final_pho

• awesome!!

• OK so people who know better than Yelp reviewers - where to go in OC for good Vietnamese food? I'll take all kinds (not a picky eater). I especially love the iced coffee. (Do NOT say Lee's Sandwiches.)

• One of you in every thread :)

• Keep in mind that you are (or were?) very lucky to be from SoCal and grew up in the largest Vietnamese community in the world outside of Viet Nam.  We claim we know what's "real" and "authentic" simply because we're from this community.  I admit, I throw around some air of arrogance sometimes, harshly judging Vietnamese food elsewhere outside of Little Saigon.  I moved out to DC for work, and yes, the Vietnamese food isn't as good as SoCal but I keep an open-mind about it because I'm not in Little Saigon anymore.  I can't complain about authenticity issues--I'm even GLAD that there are Vietnamese establishments out here.  My biggest fear is living in a place without one....yikes.  

• And regarding the spitting comment--that can happen anywhere, even at American dining institutions.

• What you consider "bad service" may just be the norm in Vietnamese dining.  The Vietnamese dining experience is very quick, straightforward, practical and to the point.  You order, get your food, eat it, then pay--that's it.  If it's anything less than that, then  that's when I would question the service.....

• Thank you for being racist yourself by intimating that all Caucasians act this way. There are plenty people of all nationalities just as bad at typing, trolling, and generally having common decency as him. I'm adding you to that list.

• I love yelp as far as getting directions and finding the nearest ATM. As far as reviews are concerned...they are a bunch of complainers. Instead of complaining behind your keyboard, write the resto a letter or kindly make a recommendation. I'd rather read a random blog.

• yay generalizations about a gigantic, culturally ambiguous country 

• I like how this commenter stuck in his own sexist joke to show off after his observation. Straddle like a girlfriend you are a genius.

• dude...someone needs a hug.

• Vietnamese business owners some of THE BEST at pretending they don't speak English when they don't want to talk to you.

• Maybe they shouldn't go to jail? Wait LOL going to jail doesn't prompt loss of respect? "oh Johnny I know you didn't mean to join the gang and that store owner you shot should live....BUT HOW DARE YOU CHOP OFF YOUR PONY TAIL!!". LMAO!

• LOL

•  Excellent and instructive article - I wish all the oafs (especially those who don't like offal and fish sauce umami) would read it and follow its suggestions -

• We frequent several Vietnamese restaurants in downtown and south San Jose.  Service is always good and staffers friendly to a one.  Food ranges from very good to better, and we have not had a bad meal yet!  We're fans.

• Seriously, bad service is bad service. If the food is great, they should get kudos for that, but I'm not going to give anybody a pass just because they are of a specific ethnicity. A: "He spat in my food!" B: "Come on, he's Khoisan"

• lmao! I enjoy reading how you think he's racist when the previous guy trolled with the MOST common American last name. 

• i totally agree about the bad service.  not the greatest but that's not important.  what some people need to get straight is that if the food is good you'll keep going despite the horrible service and that's all you need to care about. 

• Mr. Lieberman......you NAILED it! I cannot tell you how many reviews I have read that are 'Dead On' as you have discribed in your article. What I really find funny is that so many of the 'offenders' or Yelp Reviewers that fall into your examples are second or third generation Vietnamese. I read the review, the comments fall into those catagories and it is normal to read in their reviews - My Grandmother never... or My Parents would never.... These so called professed experts on the cusine of their parents or grandparents homeland know about as much about their Native cusine as I do about genetic engineering...which is ziltch!

• I have actually spent time in vietnam and know of places that do in fact as of 2009 still serve dog. The same can be also said of South Korea, so just because your a "Californian Vietmanese Cuisine" expert doesn't mean you know it all. In the end, there are more people "exploring" with similar pallets than veterans so if the average joe doesn't like the place. Chances are most won't either

• " If the meat was poor quality, say so in your Yelp review, but don't intimate that it might have died with a woof instead of a moo. " Um...what are you talking about?

• The pictures on Yelp are for the most part more credible than a majority of the reviews. This article made me hungry going to get some "Fow" for lunch.

• vietnamese food is the way of life.  nothing else compares.  i am married to a vietnamese women and have enjoyed vietnamese food for the last seven years.  i can now prepare about 15 different dishes and plan on learning to cook more. there have been days when i have eaten pho for breakfast, lunch and dinner.  most vietnamese food is very healthy and you can enjoy the quick, fast, casual or a sit down two hour dinner. i could write pages on how good vietnamese food is but i won't. if you aren't too adventerous then start with a sandwich or one of many soups.  work your way into the good stuff. fish sauce for life

• I think the deeper point is that the comments reflect a widely held attitude of resisting any sort of positive exchange of cultural values/understanding through food?  As in, it won't help him to not go on yelp, because these views will still be present and presenting them on a large platform such as yelp will only make them more common.

• People in Orange County can be pompous about absolutely ANYTHING, apparently.  Get over yourself. If you don't like how people review on Yelp, maybe you shouldn't use that site. That's the bulk of your argument against Yelp reviewers who complain about restaurants.

• Lol I love how you assume he's Caucasian. Racist fuck.

• LOL... did you just say "the people who give immigrants the opportunities to represent their culture" ? You stop being childish and naive. Go back to school, asian culture esp in san francisco has been terrorized. Banning of asian cultured ways such as using sticks to hold crates/baskets. Thats been banned. Asians who have pony tails and are sent to jail must cut it off losing all respect from their culture/family. You need to be more open minded and be more educated before you speak. And no americans did not give immigrants the right to represent their culture. The people did, and the people are the ones who govern the country.

• What color is American? Stupid ass LOL. Hes saying the culture of americans, esp the melting pot of it. The asians, black, hispanics, whites, etc. Get over yourself.

• Heh.. its okay hes a pathetic troll. He is representing his  Caucasian race very well... esp saying "thier" "teh" "may then take over".. Just makes him look like a totally uneducated trailer trash that eats hotdogs/burgers/canned food because he's so mad with the world that he didnt get a great education and get a real job. And by the way Mike Smith.. if youre going to talk shit, do it in real life, stop hiding behind a computer. If youre fat i apologize if your ass is stuck in your chair. Have a great day sir, and hope you... go back to school..

• As a Yelper and a Vietnamese food fan, I have to say "Amen" to your article.  Thank you for putting into words my thoughts and sentiments. 

• As a restaurant critic, food writer, and author, as well as a Vietnamese-American who has spent 20yrs in Southeast Asia, and 24 years in the US, all I have to say is this open letter is spot-on. Well done.  If a miserable diner applies the general approach the author has outlined to any unfamiliar cuisines/restaurants, he will have a much better experience venturing out.  May good food and good company bring you a long happy life. Cheers, Andrew X. Pham

• good article! :)

• Many of the hard working restauranteurs out there hail from Saigon, Da Nang, etc. not SoCal. I've been to good and bad VN places on the coasts, in the Midwest, and in Vietnam itself. I say keep looking, find one you love, and tell your friends.

• Yeah, the melting pot of the planet if full of so many close minded people, right? The people who give immigrants the opportunities to represent their culture in a successful manner probably needs to stop. Stop with the childish generalizations and, ironically, open your mind.

• Easy Solution: Stop Yelping. It's a dumb site: only fit for whiners and complainers. If you have a bad meal at a restaurant, don't go there anymore. Just look forward to your next meal.

• Is American a race now?

• Great article!! As a Yelp elite, I am very honest about the Vietnamese cuisine offered here in the Midwest. Either it's not authentic enough or not even close (I'm from socal). I have gotten a few people upset for being HONEST about the authenticity of food here in the Midwest.

• F@ck all Yelpers. You think you're hot shots and all just because you can write a review and check in. And f@ck all the Yelp Elite especially. Pretentious bastads. You're not special. No one really cares about you or likes you outside of your fake "elite" status circle.

• You forgot to mention that "Ox Penis" is an option on the menu! Yay! HAHA!

• Thank you for such an awesome blog post! So true!

•  totally agree! www.curryupcafe.com

• Nice racism. I will listen to everything you have to say now.

• Americans are THE most closed minded people in the world. No matter where I travel Americans are the only ones bitching about everything...e.g...”how come there's nothing to eat....dont they have burgers and fries?"

• Great article - glad you took the time to write it!

• This is hilarious because I just went on Yelp Saturday night to find a Vietnamese spot near me in HB and was outraged that my time was spent sifting through garbage banter! Good article.

• Good article. Small businesses really don't need that sort of ignorant, clumsy criticism in these tough economic times. It's a Korean-eat-dog world out there.

• from Hyphen magazine, a SOLUTION to precisely these Yelp woes:  http://www.hyphenmagazine.com/node/3117

• My biggest pet peeve with yelp is ,people write a review after one visit...you should go more than once ,try different things,then write about it ..also if they don't like a place I like I look what they do like and it's usually chains...

• Love this article. Great constructive advice. Will note for my reviews.

• Can I get it without MSG?

• The dog meat is still funny as hell, and while they dont serve it in little saigon, its still true that dog is consumed in many parts of asia, and im freakin asian!. This blog is an open letter to yelpers, and Yelp is an open letter to this blogger.

• Who the hell are you...

• hey mike smith go choke on a dick

• this dumb fuck must be on drugs!

• fuckin gooks..hide your dogs and cats! ho chi minh fuckers! motherfuckin gooks can wage a hell of a war though..killed the americans and slaughtered thier own in teh south..big ups to the viet cong..may then take over and wage another bloody entertaining mess!

• i love you!

• I like how the author stuck in his own racist joke to show off after the translucent reference. It was actually pretty funny. Bark not moo you are a genius. Fiegn it off like you are scolding then jump on the bandwagon and give a go. Both sides of the fence are fun to play and you are straddling like the college girlfriend of a heisman winner.

• Hey Dave, I've got a couple of windmills that need tilting. 

• ... But the rudeness of the service wasn't my fault... :( 

• I second that emotion! I used to have a pretty good understanding of Vietnamese food. Then I went to Vietnam and then I married a Vietnamese National . Now I embrace all parts of the cow, pig, fish etc. I eat the stinkiest sauces. I even went to Phan Thiet and Phu Quoc and took a tour of a fish sauce factory. And my life is much better from it. I take Yelp with a grain of salt. These days everybody thinks they are JGold. A word of advice...free your mind and your palate will follow!

• I agree with everything in this article except fish sauce smelling awful. That smell is INTOXICATING. Of course that might have to do with me being Vietnamese...

• awesome!!!! well done

• As far as I can tell, this video is only a couple days old, but it's pretty funny. It's Funny or Die taking on obnoxious Yelpers. It was probably only a matter of time til it was on OCW. http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/72fe31e013/tricia-johanna-yelpers?rel=player

TotalComments: 93