That's the speech that led to six years of litigation? Sounds pretty vanilla to me.

I assume churches are held to the same employment protections that any normal business is right??? You cannot and should not be able to fire an employee based on race, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation....PERIOD!

VC, your assumption is incorrect.

As a fellow church musician (30 years), I can empathize with Bob Gunn and the pain he has been through. Mr. Gunn is probably one of the most talented church musicans in America. It is a choice though to either hide one's sexuality when working with and for evangelicals who are still homophobes OR work within the ranks of open and affirming congregation and denominations such as Methodist, Episcopal, United Church of Christ, Church of Religious Science. Thank God for organizations like soulforce.org who are trying to educate these misinformed church denominations. The risk of being outed is always present and there are senior pastors, music directors, church musicians worldwide hiding in huge closets. This is nothing new. God ultimately is the final judge and someday the accounting ledgers will be justified. Until that time, educating church leaders on appropriate ways to handle delicate issues surrounding terminations would be a start, hiring experts in the field of HR would be a start.

To defame an employee from the pulpit just doesn't make sense and is wrong - period, during or after the fact. Kenton Beshore and his board should be embarrassed and shamed for the lack thought and discretion in how they handled Mr. Gunn's termination. Somehow I doubt that the church had anything in writing that would indicate same sex preference would be grounds for termination. Most companies to protect themselves legally put all types of issues in print during the hiring process so no store is left unturned.

Since this church is so legalistic, a likes everyone to follow every thing according to the letter of the law,
Cheri Liefeld should also have been terminated for keeping Mr. Gunn's sexuality a secret - which was total against the church's employment policy. What is good for the goose is good for the gander. I see no reference to her being terminated or disciplined in any of the details surrounding this case. Technically every staff member who also is divorced and or does not have their private home in order should also resign. I think very few staff members would be left.

"For five years, Cheri Liefeld kept a damning secret: Bob Gunn was gay."

Mel White coined the phrase Spiritual Violence; evangelicals are famous for this. Two issues seem at stake; taking the risk of working in an environment where one knows up front they are operating against the standards / convictions of an employer; secondly the proper way to confidentially terminate an employee who does not meet the criterion needed and or required. When these elements are connected to any religious organization, the ramifications are always hurtful and if not handled swiftly and professional can result in a catastrophe. Even the late Jerry Falwell with the Old Time Gospel Hour ministry was flooded with gay and lesbian closeted folks at every level of his payroll - and he knew it. I graduated from his University in 1980. I am told the same is true at TBN.
From his TV production staff, music department down to the mail room there are still gay and lesbian people there today who have chosen to hide their true sexuality. Often ministers will exploit the creativity of Gay and Lesbian people and allow them to operate in the closet - this is also wrong. I have no doubt that Kenton Beshore and other members of the staff and board at Mariners either sensed or knew Mr. Gunn was not a heterosexual, but they exploited him for his talent and ability for many years and when someone choose to out him - the game was over.

Many years ago, I was told that a former Music Director at the Crystal Cathedral was followed around secretly by detectives because a member of the Schuller family suspected this person was gay. In fact the church board demanded this individual sign a statement stating that there were not a homosexual - he refused. He in fact told them he was hired to do the music for church - and he was very quailified to do so and he would stay and do what he was hired for - but he refused to sign the statement and stayed for over 20 years.

Many issues here in Mr. Gunn's case, very complex with a very sad outcome. I appreciated OC Weekly bringing out this situation and may it be a lesson for all concerned. I am saddened to learn that neither Mr. Gunn or any member of the church refused to be interviewed in person while Mr. Arellano was trying to gather the facts surrounding this case. A deeper look at the New Testament Scriptures by Mr. Beeshore and the board might in fact turn up some real heart rendering issues. For starters there has never been a word in the Greek language for homosexual.
So that passage in Romans which is quoted so often by fundementalists really has more than just a grey area shrouded over it. But I digress.

Arthur Scott you're an idiot.

Dear Toby,
I am not sure what your goal is. I found Arthur Scott's interpretation of the relevant issues to be fascinating, insightful, and intelligent. I can only assume that you disagree in some way with these interpretations from your rather archaic comment. Please defend your argument in as respectful, intellectual, and elaborate manner as this idiot: Arthur Scott. If this mature alternative is not one that you are capable of, please leave. It still may be this digression result in some respectful insight.

I am always fascinated to hear people with very little knowledge of theology or the Bible speaking so passionately and firmly against the Church in defense anyone acting willfully against God's precepts. In the "true" Christian community, any sin against God is considered a very serious offense, and God requires his followers to correct and restore any person or situation in specific ways - this is biblical! What Mariner's church did in the case of Bob Gunn was a standard practice in the community of "true" believers. These methods of correction are standards set by God in the Bible, not by human beings. Any person in leadership or as a follower of Jesus Christ is required to be obedient to these instructions (no exceptions to the rule). Any person is capable of commiting a willful act against God, heterosexual or homosexual- there are no double standards here. Most importantly, the God of the Bible places great importance on how His followers live out his/her sexuallity. Sexual inmorallity, in the Bible, includes many sexual activities, not just homosexuallity (pre-marital sex, sexual relationships outside of marriage, prostitution, pedophilia, rape, poligamy, etc.). Arthur Scott is wrong about the Bible not being clear against homesexuallity. Here are a few verses specifically addressing homsexual issues: Genesis 19:1-11; Judges 19:22-30; Leviticus 18:22; Romans 1:26-27; Romans 1: 32; 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, etc. It is my intention to clarify any misconption people may have about what really goes on within the "true" Christian community.

This is why I am no longer a Christian. You fake ass people claim you're loving and Christ-like but when you see a homosexual, you can't control all your anger.

And all you fake Christians preach about how to love them, and not their sin.

BULLSHIT!

Christianity is all about making excuses to hate, excuses for ignorance!

You're not afraid to hate others, go against your God, because you'll have an excuse for it.

lol, your loss for following a false God, false religion, and false beliefs.

Hell, Satan, and the Bible are fictional.