Lincoln Club of Orange County Proposes "Legalization" Path For Illegal Immigrants: Permanent Serfdom for Mexicans

• Where do you get stats?  Online? Did you have the same statistical info/opinion before the advent of the internet?  And if you didn't did you feel the same way as you do now where did you get your info then?  I love reading your posts as coming across so scientific and quantitative, yet you don't really get any of it...keep it up! Cheers

• Illegals need to become legals !

• Although I do agree a controlled program for ag work might be beneficial -- if it were truly controlled.

• From guys looking for work picking apples to middle class people holding benefit carwashes to raise money to SWPL folks going out to 'u-pick' orchards or 'adopting' fruit trees, to youngish middleaged construction workers idled due both to economic conditions and to competition from immigrant labor (and their ethnic networking), I think you vastly underestimate the willingness of Americans to work. Take the In-n-Out test -- go to a restaurant and their staff will be all Americans and reflect the neighborhood. The McD's nearby will be all Mexican. Why?

• You have  excuse Gustavo, he still is laboring under the fantasy of Reconquista: Mexico's Retaking of US Territory.  Anyone who speaks against him is a "troll."   Gustavo, I wear that badge with honor and "Remember the Alamo." 

• Considering it would have to be accomplished by the inmates running the asylum (Congress) you are probably right about it not being achieveable.  Let a State try to implement such a plan though and the Justice Department would be all over them like a tumble bug on a pile of brown stufff.  Immagration is just another spoke in the "wheel of failure" by our government.  Nothing will change until voters get totally fed up with and fire most of Congress.   

• I don't see any suggestions of amnesty for those illegals already here, in the Lincoln Club proposal so that goes a long way in resolving my concerns.  Frankly, the three point they made; sealing the border, guest worker program and making sure employers are not hiring ilegals all make sense.  Any way you slice the loaf folks, the kind of Americans it would take to do the back breaking work in the fields, at the car washes and other tough manual labor positions are nonexistent.  The only way you could even get a few of those positions filed by Americans is to cut off welfare and force those recipients to do the jobs.  A strong and well managed Guest Worker Program would solve a lot of issues.  Such a program could even be designed as an expedited path to legal citizenship in the United States.  Too bad one or more of the Republican Presidential candidates haven't already thought of and adomted such a plan. 

• Great news to the extent it is true. 

• Did you see Cindy's article in the OCR? http://www.ocregister.com/news/mexico-326587-santa-family.html

• Dave, Dave, Dave, Labor costs are about 10% of final produce costs you pay at the grocer store. If you do the math, wages could triple and your $1.00 lettuce would become $1.20. Significant, yes, but we'd benefit in other ways (less spent on propping up poverty in the imperial valley, for example). At any rate, a whopping 3% of illegals work in ag. It really isn't an issue in this debate, except as a distraction.

• I don't *demand* any of them. Unfortunately to live in SoCal is to have to deal somewhat with illegals, the saturation is so great.  However, I seem to remember houses being built, cars being washed, kids being raised, before the huge Mexican influx of the last two decades. As it is, I wash my own car, tend my own plants, clean my own  toilet, and limit my fast food intake mostly to In-n-Out.

• You know that joke about 'the half with the good roads'? Highlarious.

• That first link is so important I am going to post the content here. From the Everett Washington Herald, a letter to the editor Fruit-picking jobs not so plentifulIn response to the letters "Ag jobs show guest workers needed" and "How many willing to pick fruit?":After reading the article about pickers needed in "Northwest Briefly" on Oct. 17, I decided to drive over to Wenatchee to see about picking apples. I am an unemployed carpenter so hard physical labor is not new to me. I also knew that making $150 a day was not likely. That is what the top pickers make and I am far from a top picker. I had a place to stay over there and figured if I could make at least $80 a day it would be worth my while. There was no contact information in the article so off I drove. I got a number to contact at a convenience store in Cashmere. They had taken down an advertisement Sunday and I was the second person to ask about picking Monday. The number they gave me was for Wenatchee Work Source. They needed pickers. They asked me if I had any experience. I told them I had picked on weekends in college 30 years ago. They told me they wanted pickers with at least a season of experience. (Three months.) They couldn't help me.I drove back to Dryden to NW Wholesale Inc. They packed pears but gave me numbers to contact.•Blue Star: I called and they told me they were pretty much done.Stimilt: They also told me they were pretty much done. But gave me a number toStimilt East Unit: I got an answering machine and left a message.I then drove from Dryden to Wenatchee on all the back roads looking for any "pickers needed" signs. I saw none. I called Stimilt again at 4:30 p.m. and got an answering machine and left a message. It is now Wednesday and I am here in Mountlake Terrace still waiting for a return call.I am a U.S. born Anglo American willing and able to climb those ladders and pick that fruit.I did not get the chance.Daniel E. ThrasherMountlake Terrace --- It's all bullshit from growers.

• ¡Que gruñon eres hoy! ¿Quien se ha meado en tus Wheaties? 

• Could you point out the lie, please. Funny thing, here I am sticking up for the country you are supposedly so attached to.At any rate, few are starving in Mexicohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obesity_in_Mexico

• "Crops are rotting in the fields. " Read this -- anecdotal yes, but so are just about all 'CRITF" stories which feature whining growers. http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20111021/opinion02/710219941 "Constructions sites have gone dormant for lack of people who know how to swing a hammer." That's funny, I thought that construction sites have gone dormant because of the bursting of the housing bubble. I'm pretty dialed into construction due to my extended family. There are a lot of guys idled, a lot who are working very sporadically, and the wages have been crushed (foremen, guys with 10-15 years experience and a lot on the ball, are getting $25 per hour, just like Whitman's ex-maid).  "I'll pick wheat or corn or cotton or tobacco," Granted, 'backy is somewhat labor intensive, but hardly back breaking work. But the rest, you are just making stuff up. See, for example 2011 Wheat Harvest, better than expected. Notice the giant machinery.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr8Pc8NkOUo Ironically, it is the efficiency (read mechanization) of American agricultural which is partially responsible for the last two decades of Mex-influx, as 'our' corn and wheat, coupled with NAFTA, wiped out the small scale and ejido corn farmers in out neighbor to the south.

• Are you Bullied Chinito and just decided to change names? Because you sure are as stupid as he was, and his cowardly ass doesn't pop up 'round these parts anymore...

• More lies from a troll who lives in them.

• OK, so here's my problem with your statement. Alabama (<I>¡a la chingada con el gobierno alabamano!</I>) passed a strict immigration law, some of which has actually been upheld by the circuit court (side note: I look forward to proving I'm not an illegal Swiss when I tell my daughter in French to be quiet during a traffic stop outside of Birmingham). The undocumented and even some of the documented, green-carded immigrants have fled—self-deporting as someone else said upthread. Alabama also has shockingly high unemployment. So the unemployment numbers have gone down, right? Americans are taking the jobs that, as you so eloquently stated, were "stolen by these third world parasites," right? <u>Wrong.</u> Crops are rotting in the fields. Factories can't keep quotas up. Constructions sites have gone dormant for lack of people who know how to swing a hammer. If these "Americans" are so desperate for jobs, why don't they take the ones that are there? Walk up to a farmer and say, hey, I'll pick wheat or corn or cotton or tobacco, and get to work? It's been months now, plenty of time.

• Sure. Prepare to pay a lot more for your food, then.

• How about stop demanding and consuming the goods and services produced by illegal aliens and/or increase the number of immigration visas for the workers that come/stay here illegally to produce the goods and services that you demand and consume.

•   It’s morally correct to look after our own suffering people first, as we have no obligation to foreigners, no matter their motherland? We have thousands of homeless veterans, left to wander in our streets; even single mothers with children, the sick and unwanted. We have our own share of poverty, without being responsible to people who have already scorned our laws. If Pro-illegal immigrant activists think they can intimidate pro-sovereignty entities, as akin to the Dept of IN-Justice is performing the same restraints against Arizona, Alabama, Georgia, Indiana and South Carolina—they are poorly mistaken—as there is a building strengthening majority of every walk of life, every American, called the TEA PARTY.   Most Americans respect people who follow the law, but just appearing and asking for handouts—forget it. Even the highest of skilled occupations, must be vetted through FBI, physical and previous employment examinations, sometimes waiting years. Those who illegal cross borders, fly in and overstay have no reverence for our countries people. What is happening right now and adding to our own unemployed is people escaping poverty, the drug dealers and criminals.      In the Austin Daily Herald reports: "There are rumors people are losing their jobs at local plants as well, due to increased hiring scrutiny amid federal immigration programs. Displaced workers who fear being fired and/or deported are going to Arcadia, Wis., to work for the Ashley Furniture plant or to Postville, Iowa, or St. Joseph, Mo., to work at other meat processing plants." Companies that have already violated ICE audits and prosecuted, have seen a large increase of regular Americans and lawful residents, lining-up for jobs—as illegal workers run off.   Out of work Americans and patriotic citizens and residents can speed up this exodus, by promoting the E-Verify mandatory enforcement program, especially if President Obama signs a new directive for a job program in ‘Construction.’ These jobs should be going directly to unemployed workers in these particular occupations. Those not working and want a job should get into action and phone 202-224-3121. This is the Washington switchboard that can direct you to all House Representatives responsible for moving Chairman Lamar Smith's ‘Legal Workforce Act’ (bill H.R.2885) to the house floor. Especially confront the new members sent to Congress by the TEA PARTY. Additionally, you can learn more about the illegal alien occupation, which permeated every community from Vermont to Arizona by going to NumbersUSA web site. Judge for yourself the truth, instead of reading the craftily engineered vitriol propaganda from the two parties.    Become a TEA PARTY member and see what you can do to halt this economic mess, with billions of dollars annually going as free public assistance, to illegal aliens who break our laws. The TEA PARTY will enforce our immigration laws and construct the fence(s) as originally enacted in 2006.  Thousands of Hispanics have joined the TEA PARTY, whose families go back generations. Only the households that have something to hide are moving towards the Obama administration. People, who respect the laws of the land, have no commitment to illegal immigration and are adamantly opposed to even their own race, color, faith if they broke the law. THERE WILL NEVER BE ANY CHANGE IN CONGRESS, LAWS, AND POLICIES IF THE SAME MIXTURE OF LIBERALS, DEMOCRATS OR REPUBLICANS HAS THE EMPOWERMENT TO RULE US. WE CAN ALTER THIS WRONG DIRECTION OF OUR ECONOMICALLY CRIPPLED SOVEREIGN LAND, BY VOTING MORE TEA PARTY LEADERS IN THE SENATE AND HOUSE. ALL AGENCIES OF THE GOVERNMENT NOT PROSCRIBED IN THE CONSTITUTION WILL BE LIQUIDATED, MERGED, PURGED OR RETURNED TO THE CONTROL OF STATE GOVERNMENTS.   Smith's Legal Workforce Act (H.R.2885) would require 100% of companies—large and small-- to use E-Verify for all new hires within 2 years. This bill would also require all federal, state, and local agencies as well as federal and state contractors/ sub-contractors and critical infrastructure sites to use E-Verify within 6 months. Increase employer penalties and fines for knowingly hiring illegal alien workers. Require the Social Security Administration to send no-match letters to employers if a current employee's name and social security number don't match in their system. Require the Social Security Administration to notify owners of a Social Security number if their number is used multiple times.   The old lethargic propaganda from the Left side of the aisle, that Americans will not do dirty jobs—is a big fallacy—it’s about good wages and benefits. Young men are rushing to North Dakota for drilling operations in an oil bonanza, because they are earning a 100 grand annually. They have created 30.000 jobs and people can get some of the action. It’s cold and dirty work, but nobody is complaining.     Remember Liberals, Democrats and Republicans will concoct any rhetoric, to dislodge any candidates, other than their own chosen favorite. Democrats will manipulate voting using such unpalatable organizations, as ACORN. The activists that run this group, is re-organizing under a different name in New York. Previously they were hiring persons of ill-repute, to register anybody who could sign their name—non-citizens and illegal aliens. Most American states have poor laws respecting the citizens right to vote and Arizona is no exception. With overwhelming numbers of illegal aliens in occupancy, the State Senator who was recalled could have been compromised. Having only to show two pieces of personal ID, such as a utility or water bill, could be manufactured on any computer. With the hasty arrival of the 2012 election, state voters must demand a picture ID, with proof-positive that the owner is a US citizen.    The name of the game from both sides is money and power. More votes for the Liberal Progressives, hidden away under the Democratic veil.  Elitist Republicans like the way things on the beltway, as they have always been. Both parties will reclaim the ‘Pork’ and the special interests with the money bundler’s and the never ending stream of financial engineers from ‘K’ Street lobbyists. Only the TEA PARTY established as a majority in the Senate or House can return America to it principle foundations as written into law by our founding fathers.

• Yeah Whites fucked up this country so bad that mojados are willing to DIE in order to come here for the "brutal exploitation". Face it puto, if Mexico still owned the southwest it would be tumble weeds from Texas to LA nothing more. Haha now don't bruise the lettuce when you pick it.

• Hey asshole what's a matter mommy didn't give you any hugs after she fucked Mexicans for money? Stop whining you cry baby everyone knows whites fucked up this country w their greed & lies now losers like you can only point their finger at sorry ass immigrants. I think it's hilarious when whites go around talking about 'their' America neglecting that the country is made up of numerous peoples from every race.Why don't you fuck off to the South where you belong!    

• haha.. gustavo is the albert einstein of mexicans!!! hmm, on the other hand, if you can count up to 10, you're considered a mensa candidate in mexico.lol

• lol.. typical ignorant mexican.. so you want to wish child rape because we want to deport your illegal scum countrymen?  keep on posting because geniuses like you and rita make all the arguments for deporting your stupid ass back to the shithole your mamacita shot you out of.. so, how many different fathers did your brothers and sisters have?

• that will NOT happen...!!!--we got Amnesty jammed down our throats w/reagan & again w/bush....all that got us was MORE Illegals...!!!!--They will be FORCED to leave or they will get DEPORTED!!!

• They WILL self-deport...(or at least the majority...), when we ALL get similar AZ., AL., SC., etc. legislation passed, AND when the obummer adm. quits sueing us...!!!--when the "carrot" has been taken away aka jobs, housing etc. & we start beating them with the "stick" checking immigration status during legal car stops, checking for DL'S, insurance etc. & then DEPORTING them when we Catch them, the others will see the light & LEAVE!!!

• Another dumb white man! You white people kill me! lol

•   You are probably upset because   Sandusky and his crew at Penn State sexually assaulted you, how you wish some mexican would have, dude your stupid, great comeback on this idiot Rita!

• Arellano is the sole possessor of Truth and Wise Policy -- to disagree with him is ipso facto 'stupid'.

• To add, until about 5 years ago there has been virtually no chance of deportation once in the country. That is changing, and so is changing the costs calculations of would-be illegal immigrants. 

• Mexico is a middle income country by global standards. However, Mexicans and others can make more money here (and few if any are making $1.75 an hour -- Whitman's illegal 'housekeeper' was getting $25/hr, for example). Paying a 'coyote' is an investment.

• Why do you think they would pay thousands of dollars, leave their homes (you can bet they love their homes as much as you, at least), brave coyotes, drug gangs, horrific conditions crossing our deserts, ad nauseum, all for $1.75 an hour?  Because their prospects were so good in Mexico?

• No gun other than a desperate financial environment, anyway.

• "tamper-proof smart cards"?  LOL http://vimeo.com/15719304

• Send them back .American citizens need the jobs that are stolen by these third world parasites

• What is stupid about following the rule of law? Cowardly? How so?  The right thing to do would be for all the illegals to self deport but we all know that will never happen. They would rather sneak in, bitch and moan every day about how unfair life is here and march and protest screaming at the top of their lungs they deserve to be legal citizens. So we should just give up, shrug our shoulders and say to hell with it just give them blanket amnesty? Not a chance. Send them all home.

• More stupidity from another anonymous, cowardly troll...

• The sensible thing to do is send them all back where they came from.

• Illegals must become legals. Soon !

• Here. Rita, is one of many cases you can read about (right here on this site) of Mexican (or Guatemalan or whatever) child abuse. http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2011/09/toilet_seat_or_father_got_11-y.php

• 'I do agree with them on the Guest Worker Program, which needs to be brought back and expanded. " Why? I don't know if you've noticed, but we've had 9 percent unemployment for, what 3 years now? Need Mexicans to pick crops? No, only 3% of illegals work in agriculture, and there already *is* an unlimited guest worker program for ag labor, if growers could be bothered to fill in a few forms, pay decently, and provide decent working conditions.

• Would not the sane course be for the to return to Mexico? That is, if they really had to 'live in the shadows'. That might be the case in Arizona (now), but not in California.

• Rita, you nailed it, you shut Mr lah down, dumb white man!

• wrong dummy, just check the archives in this rag.. plenty of stories of mexican animals mating with their own children

•  Hey Mr. liberal are hypocrites, last time I checked the only ones molesting kids were white guy's at Penn State with a Head Coach last name Paterno doing the cover up, just wanted to clear the air, oh, by the way I'm white and a Republican! Just like you. 

•  You must live in Leawood.

• The Lincoln Club's idea is politically unsustainable, unoriginal, and without a snowballs chance in hell of succeeding.

• lol... miserable? naw, i live a very nice life, only 2% mexicans in my neighborhood and they know their place and keep pretty much invisible..our local cops do a great job weeding out the riff raff.. the only time i have to deal with the wetbacks is when i go to public places and invariably end up behind a gordita with 7 kids and wearing high heels to go to disneyland.. hahahaha

• Fair? Nope. Designed to keep immigrants in subjugation? Yeah, probably. Designed to exploit the immigrant population for the benefit of los ricos?  No doubt.  But as one who works almost daily with the undocumented here in sandland (AZ), I think there would be many of the undocumented population who would say, bring it on. They are tired of hiding in the shadows and worrying that they will not have enough to bond out if la migra takes them, or their mother, father, etc. Not a good resolution, but maybe a step toward some lower level of sanity.

•  WAH WAH WAH. I'm SO glad there are so many Mexis here to make your life miserable, just like Mitchie...

• "the bracero program, the exploitative agreement between the United States and Mexican governments..." Aside from the 'exploitative bracero' part (no one held a gun to braceros heads)  I agree with Klavito. These establishment Republicans are real POS's, complaining about taxes and Democrats and then hiring lawn guys are going to carwashero places. Hint, guys, that dude waving the leaf blower around for 10 minutes has a wife at home who is *less* likely than yours to be working. She and her kids are consuming *way* more taxes than the family can pay on the under-the-table wages you pay them. That's why, despite our sales tax being 25% higher than 2 decades ago, the state is still broke. If you are paying  an illegal lawn guy or carwashero or 'nanny', you have no reason to complain.

• Considering the good ol boys at the Lincoln Club, I would suggest that their philosophy doesn't extend as far as trying to cultivate votes for the Republican Party.  My opinion is that it is strictly a financial, dollars in the pocket motivation.  They and their friends are up to their ears in business interests which exploit cheap illegal labor.  Frankly, they don't want to give that up.  I do agree with them on the Guest Worker Program, which needs to be brought back and expanded.  Keep in mind that these are the same Republicans who have propped up the Agranistas at the Great Park, looking the other way to the gross mismanagement and corruption, solely for the purpose of feeding at the trough themselves.  It is people like this who have helped destroy the Republican Party in Orange County. 

• well, what do you wetbacks want? should we all give you 100,000 and have you molest our kids too?  ungrateful cockroaches...

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